CGI or ASP or XML

[ctaylor]

I'm would like to learn more about web programming, specifically about how to implement a web-based front end to a data base server.

Given that my web-programming skills are currently limited to some basic HTML, I'm looking for some advice as to whether ASP, or CGI would be a better language to study. My other programming skills are limited to MS Access VBA, VB, console-based C++ and some specialized scripting languages for use with particular software programs.

Given that I would be interfacing with a database, would XML be a better topic area to study?

Any (constructive) thoughts would be appreciated.

Thanks

[crouse]

PHP

I wrote an article for techimo that's posted here:

PHP: The Future of Web Design
http://www.techimo.com/articles/index.pl?photo=97

[jkrohn]

If all you want to do is frontend -> backend programming, then go with PHP. It is by far the simplest language, and will do what you need it to do.

If you want to do more than that, look into Perl. It is much more powerful, and with a background in C++ it should come eaisly to you. Unlike PHP, perl can be used for standalone programs as well as CGI, and it is very useful to know for a variety of other tasks.

Either way, PHP and Perl both provide very easy ways to access and manipulate databases.

I would shy away from ASP (using vbscript) as it is the weakest of the languages, and is a windows only language. The other two are platform independent.

I personally have used all three and prefer the power and ease of Perl. At first perl will seem much harder as it requires much more strict adherence to syntax, but coming from C++ this will be no change. PHP will be the easiest to pickup and go with as it is very easy to learn and very fault tolerant.

If you have any questions let me know.
Jkrohn

[ctaylor]

Thanks for the feedback!

This provides one more reason for me to take a look into PERL, and a first reason to look at PHP.

[Iturea]

To say one technology is better than another only limits your ability as a programmer. I have read countless articles about the whole PHP / ASP battle and it just cracks me up. It is like the whole Linux / Windows battle or Ford verses Chevy. Everything has its ups and downs. Nothing is perfect.

Just pick a technology that suites you and think about the platform you are programming for. As far as the complexity of any language, just go down to your local bookstore and buy a “Sams help yourself learn blah blah blah in 24 hours”, or something similar. No language is any harder to learn than another for all people everywhere. That is a huge misconception based on preference instead of the actual truth. I know plenty of people who think perl was the easiest language to learn because it just clicked in them. The inventor of perl didn’t make it to be hard. Every language was originally invented to make things easier for the tasks they were designed for. I also know plenty of people who think vbscript is the easiest language around. I personally think C++ is the easiest language to learn and use. Who know what you will think.

I am totally neutral when it comes to these topics. I prefer ASP or ASP.net when I am on a windows based computer running IIS. Why? It’s simple, because the server objects are specifically tailored for ASP. In other words, why make things hard on yourself? Can you run PHP or Perl in IIS? Yes, with the right drivers. Will it run slower? Not noticeably! Will it be as easy as ASP? Not for the average person! Therefore, why bother?

When I am using an apache web server I don’t use ASP, not because ASP runs significantly slower on apache, but because the server objects change according to the different server specs (version,etc); therefore, ASP would naturally be less effective on an apache server. Can you run ASP on apache? Yes, all you need is the right driver.

On apache I prefer C++ or Perl in a CGI gateway, Python, or PHP.

I have seen plenty of speed tests on the internet as well. What a big scam! There are a lot more factors at play than the technology itself (IE: platform, Web Server Version, Driver version, CPU, Server Memory, etc, etc, etc.) The list could go on forever…

The fact is – if you are on a Microsoft based site or the dude writing the article is pro Microsoft – then he will say and show charts that ASP is faster than everything!! That just shows his stupidity.

Likewise, if you are on a Pro Linux site running apache or something equivalent then they will say PHP or PERL blows ASP away and will have the charts to prove it.

Similarly, Ford claims to be faster and better than Chevy and Chevy claims to be fast and better than Ford. GROW UP PEOPLE!!! WHAT A WASTE OF TIME AND INTERNET BANDWIDTH TO PROVE SUCH IDIOTIC THINGS THAT MEAN NOTHING IN 1 YEAR OR LESS WHEN A NEW AND SUPPOSED BETTER VERSION OF SOMETHING COMES OUT!!

As far as XML is concerned, its primary purpose is to provide a platform independent way to organize and capture data. It is a great way to provide a web service for other websites and/or software programs (running on any platform). You see this commonly in Internet Blogs. An XML document is by no means a database. A lot of people get that concept confused. If you want to use XML documents as an independent database then you will run into a bunch of security problems. A true database will always be more efficient and much more secure. XML has no security by itself. The only way to secure an XML document would be with your web server (in protected directories). A good database, such as Oracle or MS SQL Server (to name a few), has its own built in security independent of the web server you are running it on.

[Creosote]

You said you already know some VBA and VB. Using ASP.Net with VB.Net wouldn't be that hard of a transition.

You don't neccessarily need to study XML to have fun with databases. I don't use it much for database work. You will, however, find that XML is used in programming environments such as ASP.Net for the web.config file, etc. But its nothing complex.

I've never used CGI myself, so I can't give an argument for or against it.