WHO is AYN RAND ?

[MegalosSkylaki]

"I can't believe what I am hearing"--FINGERS on "Bushisms" Thread by Shahani

I was going to reply when my browser died, so I figured the writer I was about to quote deserved a thread of her own.Indeed, it had become murky.

"One of the most eloquent symptoms of the moral bankruptcy ... is a certain fashionable atitude, " there aree no blacks and whites, there are only greys' "

--Ayn Rand,The Cult of Moral Greyness , inThe Virtue of Selfishness(1961).

You may have seen The Fountainhead a movie based on a noval or --less likely--We the Living with Alida Vitti, a 3 hr. movie never shown.

While I find disdainful the 1961 use of white and black as linguistic proxies for good and evil, the points are as applicable today.

"if, in a complex moral issue, a man truggles to determine what is is right and fails, or makes an honest error...morally he is 'white'. Errors of knowledge are not breaches of morality....But in order to escape the responsibility of moral judgement...he evades the facts of the issue and struggles not to know....he is as 'black' as they come"

Regratably , IMO, there is too much splitting hairs and not enough clear thinking.

"Like a 'mixed' economy, a man of 'mixed' premises may be called 'gray';but in both cases he does not remain 'gray' for long. ...there may be 'gray'men but no 'gray' moral princip;les. Morality is a code of black and white." IBid.

Put more bluntly at some point you have to take sides.On 9/11/01 the side is clear enough.So is destroying a Country.

"Such are the reasons why---when asked: "Surely you don't think in black and white, do you?'--the proper answer (in essence, if not in form) should be "You're damn right I do !' " Ibid.

Best wishes to all !

MegakosSkylaki

P.S. I agreed with FINGERS point as I hope is evident.

[Knothead]

"Who is John Galt?" Atlas Shrugged, Ayn Rand

Ayn Rand: She's the lady who hipped a high-school age Knothead on the concept of absolute thinking...I think Ms. Rand's spiritual successor is Camille Paglia, who is MUCH more of a HOOT!, too!



Edit: I got the title wrong!

[Mr. Goodbytes]

sure have been missing those

Anyway, since I've just finished reading The Virtue of Selfishness for the second time, I figured that I had to participate.

"The Cult of Moral Grayness" and the preceding article "How Does One Lead a Rational Life in an Irrational Society?" should be read by every person able to read. Those two are dynamite, and I'd even recommend reading "Collectivized Ethics," but read the first two even if you don't read the entire book. It's tough to get started, let me tell ya.

I think some more quotes from "The Cult of Moral Grayness" deserve recognition as well. The whole article is really about Absolute Truth, even though Rand doesn't bring up the exact term.

A similar notion,..., is held by some people who believe that the doctrine of moral grayness is merely a restatement of the proposition: "There are two sides to every issue," which they take to mean that nobody is ever fully right or fully wrong. But that is not what that proposition means or implies. It implies only that in judging an issue, one should take cognizance of or give a hearing to both sides. This does not mean that the claims of both sides will necessarily be equally valid, nor even that there will be some modicum of justice on both sides. More often than not, justice will be on one side, and unwarranted presumption (or worse) on the other.

Rand is right on the money here, as is the case in most of the book. Naturally issues can become much more complicated, and simply stating that one side is right, and one is wrong, becomes a very trying task. Rand comments further on that:

There are, of course, compex issues in which both sides are right in some respects and wrong in others--and it is here that the "package deal" of pronouncing both sides "gray" is least permissible. It is in such issues that the most rigorous precision of moral judgment is required to identify and evaluate the various aspects involved--which can be done only by unscrambling the mixed elements of "black" and "white."

Rand goes on to say that the error in all this confusion lies in the fact that people/society neglect or forget to address what morality is all about: man's choice. And this leads them to forget "the difference between 'unable' and 'unwilling.'"

This permits people to translate the catch prase "There are no blacks and whites" into: "Men are unable to be wholly good or wholly evil"--which they accept, in foggy resignation, without questioning the metaphysical contradicitons it entails.

But not many people would accept it, if that catch phrase were translated into the actual meaning it is intended to smuggle into their minds: "Men are unwilling to be wholly good or evil."

I can go on with this book forever, and I hope there are some well thought out replies in this thread. Thank you, MegalosSkylaki, for bringing up this topic. People need to be aware of the mistakes they inadvertantly or possibly intentionally make when they speak of grayness in such a manner. Let's keep this thread rollin'!!

[MegalosSkylaki]

Name, rank, serial # , please

How much does she eat ?

"Individual rights are the means of subordinating society to moral law." --Ayn Rand , Man's Rights", Ibid.

Name a movie they made out of her, Knothead.
What ! She's not made of celluloid ?
Hmmmm...

Truth be told, I can't imagine what you were like as a teenager and I am too old to read books....

Send us over some quotes, will ya ?
I read quotes
ThanX,

daDOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOG

[caddmannq]

I've never read Ayn Rand, save a few quotes here and there. Maybe I sould pick it up. I'm certainly not too old to read books!

[Knothead]

Camille Paglia is....HEY! I don't wanna talk about Ms. Paglia on Ayn Rand's thread!
Well, I will, actually, but you HAVE to stop barking like that.

Anyway, I liked Mr. Goodbytes post (and yours as well, DoooG)since they had good quotes from a book I haven't read yet. Ayn Rand made a strong impression on me at an early age, owing to her absolute willingness to make absolute statements!

There is NO "wiggle room" in her writings. Ambivalence is a word that she probably crossed out of her spiritual dictionary.

Also, Rand's holy reverence for what is strong and good in the human spirit made me immediately decide that Jean-Paul Sartre was hopeless, a guy who prolly became a Philosopher only because he figured out it didn't involve any heavy lifting.

(Incidentally, Sartre had ONE thing going, though; He figured out that if you go around acting all glum, people will take you seriously....ugh. Sure is easy to get a rise outta folks by declaring that this or that is inappropriate or just plain bad...but try doing 5 minutes of good stand-up comedy!)

Her constant theme of excellence in all things, in the works of the human mind and hand, filled me with inspiration which, happily, still hasn't left me!

Although I'm sure that believing myself being filled with so much ABSOLUTE truth and beauty made me just as obnoxious as only a teenager can be....

[Knothead]

Originally posted by caddmannq
I've never read Ayn Rand, save a few quotes here and there. Maybe I sould pick it up. I'm certainly not too old to read books!

Oh, Cadd, pick-up Atlas Shrugged... it's a novel, it pretty much lays the bricks down for anything else of hers you might read! Really, really incendiary!

Myself, looks like a trip over to Barnes and Noble is in order. You guys got me all curious-like.

[willy_ph]

Doesn't she preach what a lot of people refer to as the philosophy of objectivism?

[Mortis]

I am. I think. I will.

My hands... My spirit... My sky... My forest... This earth of mine...

What must I say besides? These are the words. This is the answer.

I stand here on the summit of the mountain. I lift my head and I spread my arms. This, my body and spirit, this is the end of the quest. I wished to know the meaning of things. I am the meaning. I wished to find a warrant for the being. I need no warrant for being. I am the warrant and the sanction.

It is my eyes which see....

Many words have been granted me, and some are wise, and some are false, but only three are holy: "I will it!."

Anthem

FountainHead and Atlas Shrugged are two of my all time favorites... other works and dwellings by Rand that I like and that come to mind: Philosophy: Who Needs It and Anthem (which is a compilation of her essays).

Although I like and have read all her Books and essays, I do not completely agree with ALL (but do many) of her positions... but, ah, they were great to read!

I agree Knothead, I am never as motivated than when I re-read something by Rand.

[Knothead]

Ohhh, Mortis... Thanks for posting that. That was one of those writings that thrilled me so much, but I forgot where it was...Anthem, eh? Thanks, Todd

(haha, when I was reading it, my heart got all fluttery!! )