Heads up about Dell (critical updates)

[John Prophet]

With allllllll the problems lately with Blaster etc...it's REALLY hard for me to understand why the Inspiron 1100 I just bought from Dell needs 27 critical updates.

I mean, yes, I am smart enough to go do the updates right away but what percentage of users would even realize the danger??

Thanks Mike (Dell).

I guess some consumer report type groups would be interested to know that Dell ships out their comps with 38Mb of updates needed....when Blaster and other worms make headline news you would think at least the major manufacturers could pitch in on a little due diligence.

Again, it is the matter of the comp industry and community being in such a state of fast evolution...but eventually things like this need to be handled in a better way.

This is somewhat the same as a car going out with faulty brakes.

The part where the industry and govt need to get together is that a wide open comp like this isnt just a threat to this one comp..its a threat to the internet in general...since every wide open comp contributes when widespread attacks occur. If this laptop is left wide open..as Dell sees fit to ship it..then who knows whether or not this innocent laptop will be taken over by some attack or exploit and used to attack other computers..maybe even Dells, or the govts etc.

So its not that a user might go thru some grief..its things like this that contribute to all those splashy headlines about worms causing billions of damage etc.

I know they work off of images etc etc..but there should be a way that they have a cd with the latest updates on a week per week basis....so when a comp is sold the last thing that goes into the box is a cd with updates FROM THAT WEEK....so that at the very least the comp will be SOMEWHAT secure.

They could probably even get govt funding for the expense involved (cuz I know that will be the whining point)

Anyway, I would suggest that resellers think about this whole issue..not only from a responsibility standpoint..but from a selling point as well.....if you are diligent to sell updated comps, talk it up as a selling point etc....let it be known that NONE of the comps you sold got hit with blaster, or whatever, because you applied due diligence.


JP

[Scott Tiger]

Good point John. Maybe that's why they include the 90 day free trail of Norton AV.

[John Prophet]

hehe, too bad it needs updating too!!!!!!!

lol.

But seriously that doesnt cover everything.

JP

[implexant]

that's pretty sick to expect Dell to update everything for you. You how much of a bandwith and updating nightmare that would be? And anyway, you paid for the software and hardware, not for them to make sure your laptop was in tip top security shape.

When I order Dells for clients, I always offer them the option of paying me to configure and update the machine. They almost always go for it.

Basically your wanting Dell to provide you with a service, for free.

Unfortunately MS takes alot of work to keep up to date and in a secure fashion. That's YOUR responsibility, not Dell's.

Just MO.

-Chris

[M_Six]

If Dell sent along a CD with patches and then someone got hacked and lost data, Dell would get sued because they didn't include the right patch. There's no way Dell could keep up with every patch, and it's the one they miss that'll get them sued. So they don't even pretend to be selling secure systems.

Besides, I don't think it's even legal for them to burn CDs with patches and hand them out.

[implexant]

I can't imagine it could be, cuz people get in trouble for putting patches on their personal websites. The patches are copyrighted by MS.

Not only would it be a logistical nightmare, but a legal one too.

As M_six so skillfully pointed out.

-Chris

[John Prophet]

Well, obviously, I totally disagree with both those arguments.

The system SHOULD be secure against all commonly known threats as of when they sell it to me..no ifs, ands, or buts about it.

PERIOD.

I am not asking Dell to do me any favors, just to sell a decent product..just handle the KNOWN issues.

I mean really, we all rag msoft for the security holes etc.....but THIS is even WORSE!!

Its like selling a rifle with a known defect and getting someone killed. And all the while the gun dealer KNEW about the issue and KNEW there was a retrofit available to fix it but he couldnt be bothered.

All the self righteous know it all techs
in this forum slammed everyone who didnt apply the blaster patch when it had been out for a WEEK.....well, SURELY you will have to slam Dell who sells a wide open, asking for trouble, unpatched system when the patches have been out for MONTHSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSS.


besides which, I am not asking them to do ANYTHING FOR ME...no, not for me at all.

Not for most people in this forum.

But how about for the thousands of others who arent techs?????? You know, the thousands who line Mike's pockets.

The THOUSANDSSSSSSSSSSSSSS who see the ads on TV stating HOW EASY AND FUNNNNNNNNNNNN computing is...AND HOW EASYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYY it is to get started!!!!!

Since they go after the new user so much they should at least give them a half chance at a decent start.


Im pretty sure we will see legislation or policies implemented to covor some of this stuff.....any crying of this excuse or that will just have to be overcome. You cant put a car on the road with a known defect and then say "it was too much trouble to make the brakes work"......or.."they should have been more well informed that the battery would explode violently within 3 weeks if not serviced, their problem, not ours".

We are talking about something simple here, not in depth security analysis...just update it as to whats available at the time, lol.


I mean really, cut the dude a break who buys the laptop and has to do 38megs of downloads on dialup..never mind that he gets the blaster worm as soon as he is online, lol. (and that the firewall is disabled by default)

take off your self righteous "it wouldnt happen to me cuz I am all that..Im super tech, I know how to click 'scan for updates'" attitudes and put yourself in a new users place....or put yourself in another scenario where YOU are the newby and you just bought a thousand dollar toy and you find out too late it has 50 known issues that any of your teenage neghbors knows how to exploit.

JP

[M_Six]

My response was not self-righteous at all. It was simply legal fact. Dell (and any other computer company) sell their systems and only the software they are licensed to sell. That's why you don't find any MS patches on their site, but you will find drivers. The ONLY legitimate place to get MS patches is Microsoft.com. I won't even try to get into the myriad reasons for that, but suffice it to say it all has to do with quality control. Ironic, isn't it?

[John Prophet]

nah, I wasnt calling you or anyone else specifically self righteous.

Just trying to make the point that we techs FORGET how the other half live.

And no matter WHAT the current "legalize" is...it will have to change. The comp industry and community and phenomenom is changing very quickly and besides that, it is unique to start with...old laws and methods arent working are they?

And if microsofts version of the law is part of the problem, then it also needs to be addressed from that perspective.

Either way, to just say its impossible is far fetched in itself isnt it?

other industries have had to make changes (airbags in cars, fuel mileage standards, smog standards)....they all cried foul also, they all said it would be impossible and it would bankrupt the company, lol.....but once the regulation is approved and signed into law..it all of a sudden goes from impossible to possible....and the car companies comply....all of the executives still make millions and life goes on but the cars are safer.

It will happen in the comp industry also.....the govt looks at all those code red, blaster type things..they look at the economy and the amount of business downtime accrued etc etc.

Anyway, thanks for weighing in on the subject.

JP